How evangelism led me to Italian church where choir, church workers were prostitutes — Pastor Emmanuel
Founder of Calvary Bible Church, Pastor Olumide Emmanuel, in this interview, reveals how evangelism led him to preaching to a church in Italy full of commercial sex workers. The clergyman, who marks 35 years in the ministry, discusses prosperity preaching, tithing and citizens’ attitude towards their country. Excerpts:
I read somewhere where you said you don’t travel to some overseas countries. What is your reason for revealing that?
In 2001, I was on a global tour that started in Europe. I toured France, Italy, Spain and Norway for minister’s conferences and evangelism. I ended up opening an office in Verona, Italy, where I even had staff members. I soon realised prostitution was a major issue there. It first hit me one day when I preached and made altar calls to people interested in giving their lives to Jesus.
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Before then, I had people who came to me seeking deliverance from sexually transmitted diseases, especially HIV/AIDS. I would counsel them, and asked how they got it. From those conversations, I got to know it was through sexual immoralities. I was also told that they could also not stop because they were under contract, more like a covenant. Because it sounded so strange to me, I started wondering: how would one say one is a born-again Christian yet into prostitution?
I didn’t understand, but I couldn’t judge them. I also could not deny what the Bible says. So, it was a conflict for me. The climax was I went to speak at a church, one of the major churches. The church population should be close to 1,000. The choir was amazing. After my altar call to those who wanted to give their lives to Christ; because of the nature of the message which was living a purpose-driven life, living a life to please God, living in holiness and all the stuff; would you believe that the whole choir came out, ministers and church workers? I initially thought that maybe the interpreter didn’t interpret very well. I said, come on; sorry, I mean, if you want to give your life to Jesus! How can you then living as prostitute? And they are in the choir, ministers, and church workers! And they claim they’re born-again, speaking in tongues. And at the same time they have a contract, they have entered a covenant with prostitution, and until they finish paying, they continue in whoredom! You know, I heard many other funny stories I cannot go into. At that point, I knew that, this place, these people here have another level of grace and anointing. I didn’t understand because I could not judge people. This shocking realisation discouraged me from embarking on evangelism in these parts of the world.
You can be described as a motivational speaker and author of over 30 books… From where do you derive the inspiration and energy to do these things?
I’ve written over 100 books. Well, the inspiration is from God, and the energy is from God. I don’t think that any man or woman can achieve anything without the support of God. It’s just been God all the way.
And one of the things I’ve come to realize is that even though people think that I’m very, very hardworking, I’m only hardworking in my purpose. If you tell me to do something that is not in line with my purpose, I will suddenly become a lazy man. You tell me to do something that is contrary to my passion, I will become a lazy person.
But when it comes to my calling, my purpose, my passion, I can work 24 hours. So, it’s all about being at the centre of gospel for your life. Like I said, fishes do not struggle to swim; birds do no struggle to fly because that’s what they are created to do. So, when you are doing what you are created to do, grace will flow, inspiration will flow.
What led you into the ministry?
In school in those days, we used to have a mid week service every Wednesday. It’s normally a fasting and prayer school. Work, lectures ended at 12 to 1p.m. One of those days, I heard a voice clearly that “Study more of my words for you need to teach my people.” Like, I always say to people, life is only forward but understood backwards. As at then, I did not know that it was the call. I didn’t know that that was an encounter, but I later got to know that it was an encounter I had and that it was God calling me to be a teacher of his word. Because from that point, I had this insatiable desire to study the word.
And every time I read the Bible, I see things that others don’t see. My level of understanding just opened up, expanded, increased, grew; and I didn’t know that it was when I started sharing with people all that I know. With others, we started doing a lot of stuff on campus: under the trees, in village, we were planting onje or two churches. Then, we did a lot of evangelising and stuffs. I became a pastor at 21. I was an assistant pastor in that church for about three to four years. So, God now called me to pioneer and start a ministry, which gave birth to Calvary Bible Church.
Some of your critics describe you as a ‘prosperity cleric’, what’s your response to them?
Everybody’s entitled to their opinion. I’m not a prosperity cleric. I’m an economic empowerment agent. I don’t preach prosperity, I teach people economic empowerment.
I teach people how to become value creators and create wealth by offering value and solving problem and meeting needs. Most of what people call prosperity message and prosperity preaching is just materialism, greed and covetousness. That’s not what I do.
Is there a linkage between the spiritual and physical world? Which one guides the other?
In the world we live in today, the spiritual controls the natural. The spiritual realm is the realm where events are called before they happen. So, before anything has its occurrence in the natural, it has had its occurrence first in the realm of the spirit. So the realm of the spirit is the root.
The physical realm is the fruit and once you understand the workings of the realm of the spirit, you’ll be able to navigate this in the physical. That’s why I always say to people that you’re either in the secret cult or you’re in the secret place. So, of course, the supernatural is the completion of the spark of the natural.
The hardship in the country has made Christians and others alike to denounce Bible passages like the 1st Timothy 2: 1-4 or Psalm 22:28; and in fact curse political leaders. What’s your view on this?
The Bible says in the last days, perilous time shall come. Many shall be lovers of themselves, unthankful and unholy, so they are fulfilling the scripture. However, when you are looking up to a man, you will always end up in shame and disappointment. God is our source. Politicians are not our source. The economy of the nation is not our source. Our job is not our source. Once you see God as your source and you look up to Him and you understand the laws and principles that govern the world and do your part, it’s only a matter of time before you escape the struggles of the world. So, I will just tell people, hang in there. Tough times never last, but tough people do. Just hang in there, and you will end the testimony.
Well, the summary is don’t be a hypocrite. Be a true Christian. Live for God. Because what we are practicing mostly in this part of the world is religion, not Christianity. Religion is more dangerous than the devil. Christianity is not a religion; it’s a relationship with your Creator. When you practice Christianity as religion, you’re going to be a pawn in the hands of charlatans behind the pulpits. You’re going to be a victim of the religion with myopic, limited, ignorant, interpretation of scriptures of the people you listen to. Be a true Christian and be an example of the change that you want to see because if it’s going to happen, it’s up to you and if you are not part of the solution, you are entirely part of the problem. I look forward to people being a part of the leadership conference coming up on the 31st of October and the 1st of November at the Marriott Hotel, GRA, Ikeja, Lagos.
There was a recent commentary by a leading Pastor on tithing, what’s your view?
I don’t have any view on tithes. The tithing in the Bible is my view. I’m a Christian. I’m a pastor. The reason why we have diverse opinions with reference to many doctrinal issues in the Bible is because a lot of people bring in their own personal opinion and personal view into the interpretation of scripture. So, I don’t do that. I don’t have personal opinion or personal view in reference to tithing. What the Bible says is what I believe, and that’s what I live by. I believe that everything that we have belongs to God. So, the entire 100 per cent of your income belongs to God, not 10 per cent, not 20, not 30, not 40. 100 per cent of your income belongs to God. People give but only a few people give exactly what God asked them to give. Don’t wait for pastors to say bring this, bring that.
Pastors give general instructions. But we should ask God for specific instructions. If you follow general instruction, you will get general blessings. God is the owner of everything that you have if you are truly a child of God. Now, as a child of God, if you now understand that God is your source and everything he has given you belongs to him, whatever He now asks you to give, 10, 20, 30, 50, 100, whatever you can give, you now give. 10 per cent is just like a minimum requirement like an act of what you say. God, thank you for blessing me, I’m bringing this thing as an act of worship, to acknowledge that you are my source and to be able to say have your way. Anybody that is limiting themselves to 10 per cent is actually preaching contrary to biblical teaching of the Bible. For me, my 100 per cent belongs to God.
